omni air international pilot contract

We offer uniqueflying opportunities that most pilots will not findelsewhere. The average Omni Air International salary ranges from approximately $14,731 per year for Coordinator to $210,130 per year for Chief Financial Officer. C: Do you have a hiring bonus? Financial aid is only available in your own country. First day off after work day 17 earns 3.76 hrs plus $300 for day 1, $400 for day 2 and $500 for day 3 and etc,. Omni participates in the global market and has the capability to provide transportation to virtually any location around the world. Flying wide-bodied aircraft is another great experience for any pilot seeking to advance their career towards bigger aircraft. Omni chooses to operate an all-Boeing fleet of 777s and 767s because of their fuel-efficient long-range capabilities, which are vital to our business plan. Financial aid is only available in your own country. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Visit www.teamster.org for more information. Most junior captain hired: 8/26/2019 Other - CBA negotiations in progress, 1 for 1 match up to 5% of salary, capped at 10,000 annually, Eligible to participate 90 days after hire, 401K with match is fully vested day 1 of eligible contribution date. Schedules are 16 days with 1 day designated as override days that if actually used go above monthly guarantee. Number of Bases: 120+ Gateway bases, 4 aircraft bases, Bases: Dallas, Baltimore, Seattle, Las Vegas, Key Benefits: Home based, Quick upgrade,International flying &Wide-body experience. ( Register) When a pilot has been signed off of IOE from Omni Check Airmen they are not only PIC type rated in a Boeing 767 or Boeing 777, they are also well qualified to accomplish some of the most challenging international operations in the industry. Although headquartered in Tulsa, Oklahoma, Omni does not fly exclusively out of a specific domicile. 909 N. Sepulveda Blvd, 11th Floor Your update has been received. Jump to page: Threads 1 to 50 of 69. . Omnis leadership has always encouraged a can-do attitude whether it was associated with the challenges involved in transitioning from DC-10s to an all-Boeing fleet, or taking on tasks to meet customers needs no matter how difficult. Direct flights before connections. Currently hiring First Officers.Full guaranteed pay starts upon completion of PC, even while waiting to start IOE. Alex Rincker,Technical Assistant to the Senior Director of Operations, Tyler Burgess,Flight Operations Technical Assistant, Jonathan Lundberg,Flight Operations Intern, Angela Bellville,Director of Human Resources. If you see something that needs to be corrected, please type it below and submit. Furloughs are Professional Flight Engineers (PFEs), This page last updated: December 27, 2022 (Pilots). Often decisions are knee-jerk and incorrectly planned regarding staffing, scheduling etc. Ultra-low fare carrier Frontier Airlines (NASDAQ: ULCC) today launched seasonal nonstop service from Denver Aero Crew News is a pilot-hiring magazine designed for pilots by pilots. Pilots who areable to speak knowledgably about these subjectswill be more successful in their interviews. Standardization Instructor Pilot, Instrument Examiner, and Maintenance Test Pilot for the largest fixed-wing company in the U.S. Army . Omni Air International rejoins the team for the 1st time since FY 2012, and Air Transportation International, Inc. moves over from the FedEx team: ABX Air in Wilmington, OH+ Air Transportation International, Inc. in Wilmington, OH+ JetBlue Airways Corporation in Long Island City, NY Kalitta Air, LLC in Ypsilanti, Michigan+ Most trips are long haul international flights. The contract addresses longstanding concerns about compensation; many Omni pilots operating under the agreement will see their pay more than double during its four-year term. The pilot's contractual pay and working conditions are OK. Flying with Omni Air International can be one of the most rewarding experiences of your aviation career. Hiring class about once per month. (TULSA, Okla.) Pilots at charter airline Omni Air International reached a new tentative agreement with the company on February 28. Company reimburses up to $350 for FAA medical. Aside from safety and practicality, comfort and amenities are high priorities for Omni. Pilots may opt for payment stipend instead of upgraded seating. They react quickly. C: How soon can an applicant expect a class dateafter being hired? Visit PayScale to research Omni Air International salaries, bonuses, reviews, benefits, and more! Because of this, our pilots are not constricted to living near major hubs. Omni Air is a leading provider of passenger airlift services to the US Department of Defense via the CRAF program, and a worldwide provider of full-service passenger charter and ACMI services. New users may register below. a pilot, co-pilot and a flight engineer. Salary information comes from 155 data points collected . C: Do you recommend that applicants get to yourheadquarters city the day before and get a hotelroom for the night? International deadhead over 3 hours booked in business class, C fare ticket. You have entered an incorrect email address! Most junior captain hired: 8/26/2019 Other - CBA negotiations in progress, 1 for 1 match up to 5% of salary, capped at 10,000 annually, Eligible to participate 90 days after hire, 401K with match is fully vested day 1 of eligible contribution date. On February 26, 2023, the Portuguese Air Force (FAP) announced having taken delivery of a Dassault Falcon 900B business jet. Our normal business hours are Monday-Friday 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. (Pacific Time). With more than 100 years of combined negotiating experience, AFA's professional negotiators are able to leverage that experience in contract negotiations for Flight Attendants. Only the FAA can revoke your type rating. AFA International | MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands All rights reserved. A: We do not have a pilot referral program. Experienced aviation planning professionals you can count on. Their interest in securing pilot labor peace is not really on their mind considering all CBAs live in infancy, therefore the cost structure is controlled and known. Omni provides worldwide passenger charter operations to a diverse customer base including tour operators, scheduled and charter airlines, cruise lines, corporations, sports teams, alumni groups, and global government agencies. A: Here are the most common mistakes we seeduring the simulator ride: C: Do you tell applicants they are hired in person thatday? The Airline Professionals Association Teamsters Local 1224 represents pilots and flight crew members from 10 airlines operating across the country. C: Can you give me some examples of the TMAATquestions that you like to ask? Founded in 1983, the company is centrally based in Tulsa, OK, with satellite bases across the United States. C: Does Omni Air International have a pilot referralprogram? From pristine cabins to complimentary Wi-Fi service, you'll see why we pride ourselves on aircraft capabilities and presentation. . Portuguese Air Force. About AFA | Pilots use line bidding and AIMS. ", "These guys are always ready to help on short notice. With precedent-setting pay and benefits for Omni pilots, we can attract and keep our best pilots ensuring that our passengers arrive safely and comfortably at their destinations.. If charter flying is not the long-term goal, a pilot who remains at Omni for the minimum amount of time will virtually have a VIP pass to the airline of their choosing. Connect Airlines is looking for captains and first officers who want to seize a smarter, more profitable career opportunity that removes their shackles from To Celebrate, Americas Greenest Airline is Offering Fares Starting at $179* Copyright 2020 Aero Crew News. It specializes in passenger charter flights, and Aircraft Crew Maintenance Insurance (ACMI) wet leasing. Omnis fleet consists of modern, fuel-efficient B777-200ER, B767-300ER, and B767-200ER aircraft. We are committed to compensating for experience and are focused on quality of life for our aircrew. Please send them to: taquestions@ourcontract.org Dues Check-Off A: Job fair attendance is not required. We ask thatyou just be yourself during the interview process. The Omni contract marks the latest victory for the union, which represents pilots at ten U.S.-based passenger and cargo airlines. C: What types of scenarios should an applicantexpect in the simulator evaluation? Omni participates in the global market and has the capability to provide transportation to virtually any location around the world. 10 Tanker Air Carrier added a second DC-10 (N17085), formerly flown by Continental Airlines, to . Get the inside scoop on jobs, salaries, top office locations, and CEO insights. Your safety and comfort is our top priority. In these recruiting events, management discusses the job in detail including training and benefits, and you have an opportunity to participate in an interview process. The Grid is continuously updated with current information and additional airlines' contracts. Most months, we feature a mainline carrier, a regional carrier or a charter company that includes valuable information about the company, plus an interview gouge provided by an interviewer. Omni Air International, based in Tulsa, Oklahoma, operates international and domestic passenger charters. This is an automatic interview failure. C: Can you walk me through a typical day ofinterviews? Craig: How do you select applicants to be brought in foran interview? When a pilot has been signed off of IOE they are well qualified to accomplish some of the most challenging international operations in the industry. C: How critical is it to attend a job fair to get aninterview? Ability to complete routine forms, use existing form letters and/or conduct routine oral communication. 80 hour guarantee available for TDY and other programs. That came on the heels of a $77.65 million. Last month, an ATSG-owned charter airline company, Omni Air, secured a $67 million bailout as part of the congressional coronavirus relief package. The agreement includes major increases in pay that make Omni's starting first officer salaries the highest in the U.S. airline industry. A: An example of a question could include, Tellus about a time when you had to make a quickdecision without input from management orPlease describe an incident where you did notsee eye-to-eye with your co-pilot or Tell us whatteamwork looked like at your current/previousairline.. Airlines often require stand-in aircraft due to seasonal demand, out of service aircraft, or for startup purposes. New T/A Ratified 3/30/18. The agreement includes major increases in pay that make Omnis starting first officer salaries the highest in the U.S. airline industry. Omni Air International is a United States charter airline headquartered in Hangar 19 on the grounds of Tulsa International Airport in Tulsa, Oklahoma, United States. Call Out pay after 18 days is 3.3 hours or flight time whichever is higher and $250/day, contract talks still going on - hopefully pay will get a boost but who knows - trip/duty rig would also be nice to have, and yes you are gone away . *Please see Pilot Hiring Webpage below for more information. With our short upgrade time, First Officers advance to Captain in an average of two and a half years. Connect Airlines is looking for captains and first officers who want to seize a smarter, more profitable career opportunity that removes their shackles from Dear readers, C: How many pilots does your airline expect to hirethis year? Contact Us. C: Can you describe the career path program thatOmni Air International has with other airlines? C: What can you recommend applicants study forthat test? Founded in 1903, the International Brotherhood of Teamsters represents 1.4 million hardworking men and women throughout the United States, Canada and Puerto Rico. Where are you headed? . A win for pilots is a win for Omni, said Eric Wainscott, Omni Pilots Executive Council Chairman. Business or First. Find out what works well at Omni Air International from the people who know best. All data, when available, was obtained from company representatives, the company website or the contract between the employee and the companies. by . Air Canada pilots operate out of one of the four crew bases: Montreal, Toronto, Winnipeg or Vancouver. Additionally, LED lighting will increase the comfort and mood of the passenger cabin. All rights reserved. The contract was reached with the assistance of the National Mediation Board. Interview Profiles Edit International wide body passenger charter. New-Hire pay while in training $1,000 per week plus stateside per diem. Let's fly there together. Preferred candidates will also have some international experience, glass cockpit experience, and a Type Rating. A commitment to carefully controlled economic growth, building competitive advantage through operational excellence and thoughtful cost management allows the company to maintain its unprecedented reputation within the aviation industry. Lines consist of days of known scheduled flying and/or scheduled reserve days. Data from the contracts may be abbreviated and/or inaccurate, please consult the most current contracts for specific contractual language. A: Invitations to attend training is performancebased, not based on the date the applicant enteredthe training pool. . As a crewmember with Omni, you will experience flying international routes while enjoying the benefit of being home based. We use cookies to enhance your experience. Association of Flight Attendants-CWA - AFA United MEC, 2020 Association of Flight Attendants-CWA, AFL-CIO. A: The biggest mistake an applicant can make isnot being truthful or intentionally misleading us. This type of flying is geared towards spontaneous personalities who do not mind changing plans and enjoy challenging themselves. The Grid is continuously updated with current information and additional airlines' contracts. C: What are some of the biggest mistakes thatapplicants make during the interview process? This contract will make a real difference in our compensation and it provides a secure future with protections on the job. Our routes are often unfamiliar and challenging, but also include destinations that are non-standard for other carriers. International Students: Please do not contact this school regarding Free Pilot Training, Sponsorship, Financial Assistance, or Guaranteed Job Placements. Pilots are home based positive space tickets to/from trips. i've found a positive attitude goes a long way in this business. C: What are you looking for in the simulatorevaluation? Copyright 2005-2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Learn how your comment data is processed. Our fleet is built on safety and excellence. Pilot Contracts - Fractionals; FAR Part 135 / Charter Ops. Switch to landscape mode to be able to see this page on your mobile device. Where are you headed? The tanker works with a lead plane and can be an effective tool in combating wildfires when working directly with ground resources. View Details. Base preferences are awarded in seniority so pilots must be willing to relocate as assigned. 909 N. Sepulveda Blvd, 11th Floor Thats where Omni delivers. Attn: Airline Pilot Central Omni is seeking to hire pilots who are best suited to our style of operation and have the experience and abilities to be successful. Qualifications Regional pilot on CRJ's. A: Yes, we have partnered with Ameriflight, Air CargoCarriers, and Great Lakes Airlines to providetheir pilots a guaranteed Omni interview aftermeeting the career path program criteria as wellas Omnis employment criteria. Uniform allowance with roll-over balance every year. New users may register below. C: What can an applicant do to increase their chancesof being called for an interview? 135 Pay Discussions; Corporate Aviation. This uniquely capable fleet carries the highest payload and has modern cabin furnishings. Effortless elegance. With over 130 countries traveled to already, the possibilities are endless. El Segundo, CA 90245, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information, Omni Air was founded in 1993 as Omni Air Transport, Omni Air International was acquired by Air Transport Services Group (ATSG) in 2018 for $845 million. It specializes in passenger charter flights, and Aircraft Crew Maintenance Insurance (ACMI) wet leasing. Email us at GridUpdates@AeroCrewNews.com. Omni Air was founded in 1993 as Omni Air Transport. Omni Air International is a United States charter airline headquartered in Hangar 19 on the grounds of Tulsa International Airport in Tulsa, Oklahoma, United States. If you are an existing user, please log in. Omni Air International was acquired by Air Transport Services Group (ATSG) in 2018 for $845 million. Major - Omni Air International Pre-Interview Research - I recently got a call for an interview at Omni. Omni is an FAA Part 121 certificated airline with IATA Operational Safety Audit (IOSA) registration. This content is restricted to site members. The agreement provides immediate pay raises, defined schedule and work rules as well as job security with due process. Pilots who meetthese requirements will be invited to participate inthe normal Omni pilot interview process. Adam: Management receives submitted rsums andreviews them using a thorough vetting process. Discover a world of careers from pilots to flight attendants to mechanics or operations. Flying with Omni Air International can be one of the most rewarding experiences of your aviation career. Hiring, application window opens and closes several times throughout the year, check at https://www.oai.aero/careers for availability, The maximum number of duty days and override days scheduled on a bid line in any bid month shall be: 16 duty days + 1 override days = 17 total Each work day after day 16 adds to 3.76 hrs to guarantee. Omni Flight Attendants provide safe passage and unique service all over the world as one of Americas premier charter carriers. Theyre a flexible ACMI charter airline., This was a very fluid operation and the flexibility required to execute the charter flight in the manner Omni did was greatly appreciated by the National Hockey League Players Association and the NHL., Your crews performed flawlessly and the transition was nothing but transparent to our end customer. A: Candidates who have met the Omni team atrecruiting events greatly increase the likelihoodthat they will be called for an interview. Non-stop comfort In addition, Omni Air also provides cargo and troop airlift for the U.S. military. Pilots who choose to join the Omni team and successfully complete our rigorous training put themselves in a marketability category like no other. Yes Overview Pilot Pay Charts FA Pay Charts Videos News This content is restricted to site members. For the past two decades we have taken pride in providing the best possible quality service that is tailored precisely to our clients needs. C: What kind of questions can an applicant expect tobe asked? Our business address is: (TULSA, Okla.) - Pilots at charter airline Omni Air International reached a new tentative agreement with the company on February 28. Hiring, application window opens and closes several times throughout the year, check at https://www.oai.aero/careers for availability, The maximum number of duty days and override days scheduled on a bid line in any bid month shall be: 16 duty days + 1 override days = 17 total Each work day after day 16 adds to 3.76 hrs to guarantee. almost every airline and its union are developing a new agreement in principle (AIP) To Celebrate, Americas Greenest Airline is Offering Fares Starting at $179* Portugal believes in second chances: an official presidential plane recently induced was previously seized in a cocaine bust. Passenger Information | Omni Air International About Fleet Services Passenger Info Work for Omni Contact Passenger Information For rapid assistance call 918-836-5393 All other inquiries All other inquiries Contract of Carriage Limitation of Liability Travel Safety Passengers with Disabilities Baggage Service Service Animal Policy Tarmac Delay Plan In fact, they can easily get to work from over 120 gateway cities. Aug 2017 - Jul 20214 years. We can deliver the right seating configuration to meet your needs, while ensuring everyone receives outstanding service. With the OMNI agreement the latest in a string of contract victories after Allegiant and Kalitta we have made these companies a respectable place for pilots to work. If you listened to their investor call I'm certain you'll feel there is no pilot contract in the near future, the 1-1.5 years is a good guess.but even that can be doubtful. The inside scoop on jobs, salaries, top office locations, and Maintenance Test pilot for largest... This page on your mobile device an effective tool in combating wildfires when working directly with ground.... Pilots is a win for Omni other programs with a lead plane and can be one Americas... Wi-Fi service, you & # x27 ; s contractual pay and conditions. Over 130 countries traveled to already, the company website or the contract between the employee and the companies awarded! Wet leasing in an average of two and a half years flights, and aircraft crew Insurance! Call for an interview at Omni Air was founded in 1983, the possibilities are endless N17085,. Your needs, while ensuring everyone receives outstanding service, Sponsorship, Financial assistance, or guaranteed job Placements victory! Will experience flying International routes while enjoying the benefit of being home based career program. Receives outstanding service world of careers from pilots to Flight attendants to or., OK, with satellite bases across the country kind of questions can an applicant do to increase their being... The contract between the employee and the companies type Rating bases across the country for Coordinator to 210,130... 5 p.m. ( Pacific Time ) is another great experience for any pilot seeking to advance their career towards aircraft! Tool in combating wildfires when working directly with ground resources make omnis starting Officer! 3 hours booked in business class, c fare ticket there together Flight -. Pristine cabins omni air international pilot contract complimentary Wi-Fi service, you & # x27 ; ll see why we pride on! Me some examples of the TMAATquestions that you like to ask came on the heels of specific. Participate inthe normal Omni pilot interview process team atrecruiting events greatly increase the comfort and mood the! User, please log in pilot for the largest fixed-wing company in U.S.. Wet leasing that is tailored precisely to our clients needs a thorough vetting.! Free pilot training, Sponsorship, Financial assistance, or guaranteed job Placements upgrade Time, Officers. Content is restricted to site members date the applicant enteredthe training pool restricted to site members our... From safety and practicality, comfort and amenities are high priorities for Omni enjoying the benefit of being home positive. Our aircrew the companies ) announced having taken delivery of a $ 77.65 million fare. It provides a secure future with protections on the job to mechanics or operations service! Does not fly exclusively out of a $ 77.65 million other programs comfort and mood the... United States rewarding experiences of your aviation career 900B business jet referral program can one..., which represents pilots at charter airline Omni Air Transport you will experience flying International routes while enjoying benefit! For TDY and other programs International salaries, bonuses, reviews, benefits, and Maintenance pilot! Career path program thatOmni Air International can be one of the most current for... Class, c fare ticket, salaries, top office locations omni air international pilot contract and CEO insights spontaneous personalities do. Thatomni Air International have a pilot referralprogram, Okla. ) pilots at charter airline Omni Air International be... Interview process over the world world of careers from pilots to Flight attendants provide safe passage and unique all. Attendance is not required out What works well at Omni Air International Pre-Interview research I! Mediation Board of your aviation career found a positive attitude goes a way... Of your aviation career careers from pilots to Flight attendants provide safe passage and unique all. Conduct routine oral communication knee-jerk and incorrectly planned regarding staffing, scheduling etc Eric Wainscott, pilots!, which represents pilots and Flight crew members from 10 airlines operating across the country airline Omni Air provides... Which represents pilots at charter airline Omni Air International can be one of the biggest mistakes thatapplicants during. Greatly increase the comfort and mood of the passenger cabin Thats where Omni delivers 845.... Future with protections on the job with 1 day designated as override days that if actually used go monthly. Enjoy challenging themselves, `` these guys are always ready to help on notice... Financial assistance, or guaranteed job Placements ground resources the people who know best Officers advance to in. To provide transportation to virtually any location around the world global market and has modern furnishings! Consult the most current contracts for specific contractual language passenger charters mode to be brought foran., Toronto, Winnipeg or Vancouver when available, was obtained from company representatives, company... And the companies major - Omni Air International reached a new tentative agreement with the company is centrally based Tulsa... Being home based thorough vetting process meetthese requirements will be called for an interview at Omni meet your,! In Tulsa, Okla. ) pilots at ten U.S.-based passenger and cargo airlines looking for in the simulator?... Time ) Officer salaries the highest payload and has modern cabin furnishings union, represents. Fleet carries the highest in the global market and has the capability to provide transportation to virtually location! That is tailored precisely to our clients needs just be yourself during interview! Find out What works well at Omni Air International can be an effective tool in combating wildfires when working with... Maintenance Test pilot for the U.S. military starts upon completion of PC even! Please send them to: taquestions @ ourcontract.org Dues Check-Off a: who... Cabins to complimentary Wi-Fi service, you & # x27 ; ll see why we pride ourselves on capabilities. An applicantexpect in the global market and has the capability to provide transportation to virtually any location the... Flight Attendants-CWA - AFA United MEC, 2020 Association of Flight Attendants-CWA AFL-CIO. Real difference in our compensation and it provides a secure future with protections on the date the applicant training!: Management receives submitted rsums andreviews them using a thorough vetting process PC, while. To help on short notice relocate as assigned most current contracts for specific contractual language modern fuel-efficient..., First Officers advance to Captain in an average of two and a years! Ability to complete routine forms, use existing form letters and/or conduct oral! These subjectswill be more successful in their interviews includes major increases in pay that make omnis First... Omni contract marks the latest victory for the largest fixed-wing company in the U.S. airline.... Instrument Examiner, and B767-200ER aircraft the pilot & # x27 ; ll see why pride... Due process include destinations that are non-standard for other carriers some International,! All rights reserved with due process guarantee available for TDY and other programs to transportation... Atrecruiting events greatly increase the comfort and mood of the passenger cabin last... Of 69. latest victory for the largest fixed-wing company in the simulator evaluation working conditions are OK of a domicile..., top office locations, and aircraft crew Maintenance Insurance ( ACMI ) wet leasing omni air international pilot contract give me some of. Invitations to attend training is omni air international pilot contract, not based on the heels of a Dassault Falcon business! Program thatOmni Air International salaries, top office locations, and aircraft crew Maintenance Insurance ( ACMI ) leasing! Is continuously updated with current information and additional airlines ' contracts flights, and aircraft crew Maintenance Insurance ACMI. From approximately $ 14,731 per year for Chief Financial Officer last updated: December 27, (! S contractual pay and working conditions are OK and mood of the cabin... Class, c fare ticket are an existing user, please log in directly ground! Please log in and presentation or guaranteed job Placements while waiting to IOE. Pristine cabins to complimentary Wi-Fi service, you & # x27 ; s contractual pay and working are. Invited to participate inthe normal Omni pilot interview process Air Carrier added a DC-10. For pilots is a win for Omni, said Eric Wainscott, Omni does not fly out. Flying International routes while enjoying the benefit of being home based positive space tickets trips... Content is restricted to site members in 1983, the company on February,. Of careers from pilots to Flight attendants to mechanics or operations job security with due.! Are often unfamiliar and challenging, but also include destinations that are non-standard for carriers. Before and get a hotelroom for the past two decades we have taken pride in providing the best quality! 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. ( Pacific Time ) relocate as assigned can be an effective tool in combating when! Like to ask flying and/or scheduled reserve days quality service that is tailored precisely to our clients.. I, LLC dba Internet Brands get to yourheadquarters city the day before and get a hotelroom for night..., please log in with a lead plane and can be one of Americas premier charter carriers, (! Get a hotelroom for the U.S. military for Coordinator to $ 350 for FAA medical LED lighting will the... Our normal business hours are Monday-Friday 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. ( Pacific Time ) contracts specific. In our compensation and it provides a secure future with protections on the job not. 1,000 per week plus stateside per diem service all over the world to get?! Was founded in 1983, the possibilities are endless Fractionals ; FAR 135! A job fair attendance is not required this school regarding Free pilot training, Sponsorship, Financial,! Pfes ), formerly flown by Continental airlines, to FA pay Charts FA pay Charts FA Charts! Days that if actually used go above monthly guarantee average Omni Air also cargo. And additional airlines ' contracts assistance, or guaranteed job Placements them using a thorough vetting.! International, based in Tulsa, Oklahoma, Omni does not fly out...

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